I have this feeling that...

Alex FL Racing Fan
@alex-fl-racing-fan
8 years ago
221 posts

NASCAR was somehow involved in this knowing the driver and track involved and there is a certain racing series that is seeing the highest ratings downward spiral since Rhoda got divorced.

http://www.racer.com/nascar/item/132040-gordon-could-stand-in-for-ill-earnhardt-jr


updated by @alex-fl-racing-fan: 05/07/21 04:38:49PM
Dave Fulton
@dave-fulton
8 years ago
9,137 posts

I don't really see NASCAR's hand in this.




--
"Any Day is Good for Stock Car Racing"
Bobby Williamson
@bobby-williamson
8 years ago
907 posts

Dale Jr. has had several concussions; he's 41 years old. If he doesn't return, or if this hastens the inevitable, what happens to "junior nation"? Where does NASCAR go from here? Star-power is approaching an all-time low.

Alex FL Racing Fan
@alex-fl-racing-fan
8 years ago
221 posts

To clarify: it's not the concussion I am doubting; it is the choice of Jeff Gordon as next week is Indianapolis that I am questioning. More likely than not NASCAR's neurologists don't clear Junior to race at Indy.

I understand Dale's position better. He saw what happened to Neil Bonnett and Bobby Allison; he knows that it's not all fun and games for him anymore.

What NASCAR should be doing is promoting the heck out of Chase Elliott, Ryan Blaney, and others the way they did Jimmie Johnson, Ryan Newman, Kasey Kahne, Kyle Busch, etc.

Tim Leeming
@tim-leeming
8 years ago
3,119 posts

I won't go into detail of the telephone conversation I had yesterday afternoon with someone very, very close to the Dale, Jr. situation. I think the major issue now is the fact that NASCAR is facing losing its most popular driver, something they definitely do NOT need at this juncture. From what I know, or was told, the only hand NASCAR has in this is folded hands in prayer that Junior will come back. It would behoove all of us to watch closely what is unfolding here, or is about to unfold.

Promoting the young guns is something NASCAR definitely needs to be doing. We have good young drivers coming along who will finally present a future to the sport when it seemed there was no future. Yet, having said that, we must wait and see.




--
What a change! It's been awhile since I've checked in and I'm quite surprised. It may take me awhile to figure it our but first look it's really great.

Dave Fulton
@dave-fulton
8 years ago
9,137 posts

Tim, this is where NASCAR really misss the Winston PR machine, who were experts at creating stars of the sport and at the same time publicizing mid-runners and backmarkers as well - something NASCAR has never been good at nor has Nextel/Sprint.




--
"Any Day is Good for Stock Car Racing"
TMC Chase
@tmc-chase
8 years ago
4,073 posts

Agreed




--
Schaefer: It's not just for racing anymore.
TMC Chase
@tmc-chase
8 years ago
4,073 posts

It's a good question. One they'll have to face eventually anyway - but I'm sure the beach suits always hoped Jr's exit could be scheduled. Again, not saying he is done - but any driver could be after any given race.

If - IF - Jr were forced to bow out now, would could argue his retirement would impact NASCAR more than Sr. A crazy thought perhaps, but hear (read?) me out. Sr's death was huge. I'm a Cup lifer - never a Sr fan - thought NASCAR could withstand loss of anyone - and didn't anticipate the reaction to his death way beyond the bounds of racing.

Yet, Cup DID have Gordon, Rusty, Stewart, Dale Jr, Sterling, Schrader, and yes even Michael Waltrip. NASCAR lost a lot of fans following Sr's death. Yet many stayed and glommed onto drivers such as Dale Jr and Harvick.

I think more of the fan base today is concentrated as Junior Nation than Sr had as a percentage of followers in 2001. Make sense? Marketing, ratings, ticket sales, merch, hype, EVERYTHING revolves around Jr.

Gordon is now gone, and Stewart will soon be. Harvick, Johnson, Kenseth, Newman, etc. are still here and competitive. But none move the needle on fan reaction. Three superstars of Cup - Keselowski, Logano, Kyle Busch - seem to push folks AWAY more than they draw them in. Would Jr fans flock to any of them? Seems unlikely.

Alex says below NASCAR should promote the new guys. I think they are to a degree. But you can only promote winners IMO. Yes, they show promise. But until Elliott and Blaney (now in Cup), Erik Jones, Bubba Wallace, etc. win regularly at the highest level, it's tough to promote a ton successfully.

Ratings are down. Attendance is down. Message boards, fan sites, merch sales - down, down, down. When Sr passed, a big chunk of a large number was affected. When Jr retires, the sport will be faced with the possible loss of a big chunk of what is now a small denominator in all metrics.

Is the NASCAR brass concerned? Guaranteed they are. Are they thinking of alternate ways to market, hype certain drivers/cars, etc.? Well, I'd certainly hope so.




--
Schaefer: It's not just for racing anymore.
TMC Chase
@tmc-chase
8 years ago
4,073 posts

The RJR/Winston deal was a lightning-in-the-bottle, once-in-a-lifetime marketing deal.

  1. Ralph Seagraves and T. Wayne Robertson were committed to the marketing program.
  2. The two of them obviously had the ear of RJR's board room.
  3. RJR's advertisting options were much more limited which created the opportunity to max what they had through programs such as racing. I've had my issues with Nextel/Sprint. But I'll concede that racing was only one of a million different platforms they've got at their disposal for consumer and B2B awareness and sales.
  4. Winston's folks seemed to "get" racing. They got to know the drivers, owners, crewmen, wives, media members, other sponsors, etc. I don't get the sense Sprint does a lot more than write a check and pay Marilynn Green's agency for a few Miss Sprint Cups.
  5. Local racing. Winston bankrolled many tracks' Winston Racing Series programs. That's where many of those up and comers cut their teeth, were ID'd as a future star, and then promoted as such. Saturday night Cup races, HD TV, short attention spans, challenging finances, and lazy promoters have killed many local short tracks. Plus, without Sprint reps at those places that continue, how would they ID the next Can't Miss?



--
Schaefer: It's not just for racing anymore.
Bobby Williamson
@bobby-williamson
8 years ago
907 posts

Agreed. There's not another Winston/RJR. NASCAR is facing the same challenges as everyone: the culture is changing and those NASCAR-loving- baby-booming-blue-collar individuals are shrinking. Along the way, NASCAR made a quantum decision: That fan, the fan that built the sport, is no longer relevant. People felt it. They still do. In spite of that, the last remnant of "old" NASCAR banded together as Junior-Nation. However, they resent and have resisted everything "new" beginning with TOYOTA. If the Toyota's win everything in NASCAR for all time, from here on, it will only move the needle backwards. It won't help. Perhaps is should, but it won't. Humanity is not rationale. It's tough to make superstars from drivers that no one has ever heard of. Every fan knew Harry Gant, for example, when he got to 'Cup. He had respect, he'd paid his dues, and he brought fans with him. The collapse of the feeder system is now "paying dividends".The old fans will continue to shrink, and new fans will never embrace to the former extent. So, NASCAR without Junior is about like DEI without Junior.....Tony Stewart aptly labeled it "a museum".

David Elrod
@david-elrod
8 years ago
12 posts

Very well put Bobby.

Dave Fulton
@dave-fulton
8 years ago
9,137 posts

Thought provoking, Chase.




--
"Any Day is Good for Stock Car Racing"
Dave Fulton
@dave-fulton
8 years ago
9,137 posts

If you missed this behind the scenes at Winston piece I wrote in 2012, it is still relevant:

http://stockcar.racersreunion.com/forum/topics/tobacco-cigarette-an...




--
"Any Day is Good for Stock Car Racing"
Tim Leeming
@tim-leeming
8 years ago
3,119 posts

That is a great piece Dave, and you are sure correct about it being relevant today. I was working press during most of RJR's involvement in the sport and I can't imagine any company in racing taking better care of the press than RJR. Ralph Seagrave T. Wayne couldn't be beat at their courtesy to the press.

Have you noticed we're half way through the year and NASCAR has yet to give any concrete answer to what company will replace Sprint.




--
What a change! It's been awhile since I've checked in and I'm quite surprised. It may take me awhile to figure it our but first look it's really great.

Dave Fulton
@dave-fulton
8 years ago
9,137 posts

I think we are in serious trouble, Tim.




--
"Any Day is Good for Stock Car Racing"
Tim Leeming
@tim-leeming
8 years ago
3,119 posts

I totally agree Dave. Even I, as famous as you made me, can't help them now.




--
What a change! It's been awhile since I've checked in and I'm quite surprised. It may take me awhile to figure it our but first look it's really great.