The fans and the sport has changed. Does it really matter?

This post is in no way an attemp to re-start the raging discussion about "Todays Cars Are Not Real Stock Cars". That is a given. This is more about the way fans view the teams and each particular make on the track. I have always been a Chevrolet fan, in most part due to the time that I became interested in NASCAR. Chevy was getting back in the sport and the feud between my uncles was growing week by week. Most were FoMoCo fans so I rarely heard anything good about Chevy. I watched and grew more interested in Chevy and by the mid 70's I was a bold fan of the Bow Tie. Now I was still a huge fan of The King and the 74 Charger, and to this day I still am. So when Petty came to Chevrolet in 78 I was a very happy guy. But this is where this post is stemming from.

Growing up I was exposed to the kind of brand loyalty that makes NASCAR fans stand out from fans of other sports. My uncles worshipped the FoMoCo teams and would not pull for any driver not in a Ford. I became that way after Petty changed to Chevy and later Pontiac. It the drivers wasn't in a GM car, I could not pull for them. My dilemma started when my favorite driver ofrecent historywas Bobby Labonte and he signed with the #47 Toyota team. The Petty teams were in a Dodge and struggling to stay afloat. I felt as if I had no team. What to do.

Now Petty is in a Ford and Labonte is still in a Toyota. I started pulling for Bowyer and have really become a fan. But I still pull for the #43 and Allmendinger and it's getting easier with the way they have been running. So, in todays sport of NASCAR, do the fans really care about the manufacturer? Is is the team, the driver or sponsor? Is this what the sport has become? Are we happy with this? I miss the days of the Car Battles. The jawing back and forth between Ford and Chevy fans. They all seem to be blending together and I think that is something the sport will miss.

Stay on topic, the fans view of the manufacturers and is it really important. Whats your thoughts?

Bumpertag in S. Carolina

So right, BT! That part of the fan experience was a major part of my upbringing as well. There were even family squabbles over car makes and racing. All part of the passion that popularized the sport. I do agree that piece of the passion is gone...along with some other pieces we speak of here often. Today's fan IS different. They view the sport with different objectives.They are attracted to different aspects of the sport. If you look at all the ways today's fans are able to engage within the sport, it is pretty impressive. In-car cameras, and audio. Multiple camera positions to view from your pc...24/7 coverage...and of course "ol DW. Yea I had to bring him up didn't I?

It's different for sure and the gap between fan support from older fans and today's NASCAR seems to be widening for the most part. The sport will not come back to us. If we are to continue to "enjoy" it, we'll have to adapt to the new way of fandom. Is fandom a word?

Here is my concern...and you've heard it before. All this driver-swapping, car-swapping, and foreign car inclusion has certainly affected "brand loyalty" as we once knew it. How can a fan today afford to support a driver that changes teams and makes so often. One used to be able to by a jacket to represent ones favorite driver and wear it for many years. Is is feasible to think fans can go from being Shell buyers to Budweiser drinkers....Home Depot to Office Depot...or Chrysler to to Ford...and then throw in Toyota...and still have that "buying" passion to drive the sport. Are they...are you...buying sponsors products the way you used to? Are the new fans supporting the sport with the strength established by the older generation? How do y'all think the brand loyalty that made all this possible will fair in the future. If the fans aren't buying the sponsor's products, where does the money to fuel this thing come from?

I know that's a lot of questions....but I think this is the biggest problem in the future of the sport.

Jeff

I'm a die-hard Ford guy....but I pull for Tony Stewart and Jamie McMurray. I mean I still got my Ford guys like Carl, Kenseth, and Ragan, and Biffle. And so what if next year,Budweiser randomly decides to sign with Tony Stewart..just because he's my favorite driver doesn't mean I'm gonna go get wasted because they sponsor Tony. Sure...it's a plus that McDonalds and Bass Pro sponsors McMurray (good food and a cool store).

But like Jeff said, the merchandising industry is hurting right now. Everytime Jr. drives a different car, a new jacket, hat, and several sizes of diecast come out. They would think that it would be a killer item, but once he drives close to 10 of these special paint schemes a year...that $60 car, $20 hat, and $100 Jacket can add up quick.

Back when, well even as recent as a few years ago. You didn't have to worry about that. You knew at the time that Tony Stewart was always gonna drive the #20 Home Depot Chevy, you always knew that Dale Jr drove the Bud #8 and Sr always drove the Black #3. Petty was always STP #43, and for a majority of his career, Bill Elliott drove a #9 Coors Ford Thunderbird.

Now, especially this year, you really can't keep up with what car/color a driver is running during the race unless youintenselyfollow the different schemes online (which I don't anymore) In fact, this Daytona 500....when Bill Elliott was driving the #09 for James Finch, in the 125 Duels', he drove an unsponsored red #09. During the 500, I kept looking for that car. But it wasn't until the green-white-checkered when he was in 8th place, that I realised that his car was know gray and blue with yellow numbers.

Sorry for so much

-Cody

We used to secretly gloat over the words in the old NASCAR rule books in the "engine" section regarding legal engines that said, "Except for the 1963 Chevrolet 427 Cubic Inch Engine."

And when Richard Howard brought Chevy back we remember what happened to the crowds. They came back.

Thanks for the great responses. I thought I was the only person that missed the manufacturer rivalrys that took place back in the early days. It's hard for me to stand up and shout, "I'm a Allmendinger Fan" because I have never liked Fords. Friends identified me by the fact that I only pulled for Chevy teams. The cars and trucks I bought were all GM, nothing else in my driveway. My password on my work computer is "Chevy". Now I find myself pulling for Ford, Toyota and Chevy teams. I feel dirty for some reason. What has become of our sport.Are the younger fans to blame or is this just the natural evolutiona sport where money can make you overlook anything? I don't see as bright a future for the sport if brand loyalty is so unimportant.

Keep having this dream that they're gonna put on a NASCAR points race with a huge purse on a big dirt track using hemis, 427s, porcupines, bias ply tires, windshield wipers, dirt screens, etc. and Cotton Owens is fielding a car for David Pearson and the fans are welcome in the pits to meet the drivers after the race.....

Keep having this dream that they're gonna put on a NASCAR points race with a huge purse on a big dirt track using hemis, 427s, porcupines, bias ply tires, windshield wipers, dirt screens, etc. and Cotton Owens is fielding a car for David Pearson and the fans are welcome in the pits to meet the drivers after the race.....

Keep having this dream that they're gonna put on a NASCAR points race with a huge purse on a big dirt track using hemis, 427s, porcupines, bias ply tires, windshield wipers, dirt screens, etc. and Cotton Owens is fielding a car for David Pearson and the fans are welcome in the pits to meet the drivers after the race.....

The cars are what done it forme. Drivers are human and are no different than the rest of us other than being a driver of a race car. Sure there are the different personalities but then all walks of life have that going for/or against it.

It wasn't the certain make (although I was Plymouth faithful) it was just the fact of the ''stock'' sheetmetal cars sitting there with the roll cages, wide tires, no windows, lettering all down the side and stillretaining the original look that camefrom the manufacturer. You could look at a Ford T-Bird and know that is what it is. Now all the sheetmetal looks the same and it takes an act of Congress tomake it that way and get it through tech....God I hate the dreaded word,AERO PUSH! Talk about ruining competition...''Car ran good today in clean air but I just could not do anything as when I tried to make a move I lost the front end''. Thatin itself ought to be enoughe to roll Smokey over. I can hear his take on it now, or at least imagine I can. It would be r-rated for sure.

I can get excited by any driver who has the sense and kahuaunas to drive it like it was stolen and get away with it, don't care the name...What does not excite me anymore is what those drivers are doing it in..slab sided, lopsided, whampie jawed somethings with a decal where the headlight supposedly went... Iwill stop.I could on and on and I am only getting more frustrated as I write this cuz I know the good (best) times are over for good as Merle would say.

Banjo, Hutch, Emanuel, Tiger Tom, thanks for building the cars that I fell in love with and still love to this day.

My uncle intro'd me to racing in 1974. He jokingly threatened me I had to pull for Ol' Blue if I expected him to tote me to the races. He started pulling for Richard in the early 60s because he drove Plymouths, and my uncle was a MoPar guy. Immediately I started pulling for Richard mainly because I like the look of the car ... and because I wanted my uncle to take me again!

But the fact Richard drove a Dodge by then didn't matter much to me I don't think. Don't get me wrong, I think that STP red/Petty blue 74 Dodge Charger was the coolest looking race car of the decade. But when Petty Enterprises went to GM in 78, it didn't cut me as deeply as it did others - including my uncle. Even with the more recent swap by Richard Petty Motorsports to Ford, I just shrugged.

My uncle intro'd me to racing in 1974. He jokingly threatened me I had to pull for Ol' Blue if I expected him to tote me to the races. He started pulling for Richard in the early 60s because he drove Plymouths, and my uncle was a MoPar guy. Immediately I started pulling for Richard mainly because I like the look of the car ... and because I wanted my uncle to take me again!

But the fact Richard drove a Dodge by then didn't matter much to me I don't think. Don't get me wrong, I think that STP red/Petty blue 74 Dodge Charger was the coolest looking race car of the decade. But when Petty Enterprises went to GM in 78, it didn't cut me as deeply as it did others - including my uncle. Even with the more recent swap by Richard Petty Motorsports to Ford, I just shrugged.

My uncle introduced me to NASCAR 1973 so wemay beabout the same age. But brand loyalty was big in their house. Nothing but a Ford/Mercury.My uncle hated Richard Petty and pulled for any driver in the Wood Brothers Mercury. Richard couldn't win at Charlotte for many years and it would drive me crazy to see him have problems. In 1975 at the World 600 Richard was running great and we had a little trash talk going back and forth and he told me, "IfPetty ever wins at Charlotte I won't be back." Petty won. He's a man of his word and hasn't been back since.

If the Wood Brothers had ever switched to Chevy's, I think he would have jumped off the Broad River bridge. He was that loyal to FoMoCo he hated to see anything else win. That is what I grew up in and some of it rubbed off. I hate Fords but I still pull for Petty and his teams. When I talk about Petty running Ford it puts a bad taste in my mouth. Maybe in time it won't matter anymore... I hope not. That is part of NASCAR to me.

We were sure dumbstruck in 1969 when Richard went FoMoCo. Didn't take long for Chrysler to woo him back, either. I seem to remember big discussions back then of Petty Enterprises not being able to adjust to coil springs. At any rate, that electric blue 1969 Ford seemed totally out of place. Today's fans who weren't following racing in 1969 can't imagine the shockwaves of that change after all the success of "Plymouth by Petty." It was like Robert E. Lee going over to the Yankees or Ronald Reagan running for President as a Democrat. It was a BIG, BIG deal back then. It would have been like Dale Earnhardt, Sr.leaving NASCAR for Indy Cars or Richard not going in the inaugural Hall of Fame class. It was HUGE.

We can have a million discussions and this will still never look "right" !!!

Those are some ugly wheels!

Ernest Sutton said:

This sure is a strange looking Plymouth.

Dave Fulton said:

We can have a million discussions and this will still never look "right" !!!

And do you remember how we used to needle each other by saying:

Fix Or Repair Daily

Fred Outruns Richard Daily

Found On the Racetrack Dead ???

I think PE leased a couple of FORD from H&M but I am almost sure that Maurice eventually reskinned a couple of Plymouths as Torino's.

In addition it has been rumored that when Petty showed up for Daytona in "69" they were 10 mph off the pace with Holman and Moody power plants. Maurice fixed that also as they salvaged a top 10 in the 500.

The reality for Petty Enterprises over the years was that they do what ever it took to run and win races even though they had loyalty for Plymouth and Dodge. Lee was running Oldsmobiles until they pulled factory support. Lee ran the Olds till they ran out of parts and then they moved on.

and boots

Jeff Gilder said:

Those are some ugly wheels!

Ernest Sutton said:

This sure is a strange looking Plymouth.

Dave Fulton said:

We can have a million discussions and this will still never look "right" !!!

THESE BOOTS ARE MADE FOR DRIVING

Richard Petty Racing Boots
From the North Carolina Museum of History, Raleigh.

We can have a million discussions and this will still never look "right" !!!

On the other hand, this gold lame driving suit will NEVER look right - be it Ford or MoPar.

Saw this little 2009 clip while looking for Richard Petty Boots photos... still rings pretty true

They should still be shining The Kings boots
By Ron Kantowski

Published Monday, June 22, 2009 | 12:04 p.m.

I was walking around the Neon Garage at Las Vegas Motor Speedway on the last day of February when the Harrah's car, which the legendary Richard Petty supposedly co-owns, pulled in for service. King Richard thought he'd have a look under the hood.

He was peering at the engine the way I do when my car quits running on the Interstate. You know, hoping against hope that whatever was making the Harrah's car run slow would just jump right up and fix itself.

Then a crewman came over and lightly nudged him out of the way.

How sad, I thought. A generation ago, crewmen didn't nudge the great Richard Petty out of the way. They offered to shine his cowboy boots.

On Sunday, when another car supposedly co-owned by Petty won the race at the old track at Sears Point in California and they brought Richard up there to the podium, he was brutally honest about the role he played in the victory.

"All they want me to do is bring in money so they can go racing, OK?" he said.

I thought that was kinda sad, too.

in the 60's it was win on sun sell on monday------- then the driver wars started in the late 70's and in steps DW doing his thing and running his mouth -- several fans followed him and Rusty was there pushing and shoving wanting recognition.Dale was getting noticed about then along with Benny and few others ---cars were not the issue but rather the drivers back during this era--if you remember there were 6 cylinders trying to run during this era too. About this time something snapped and the fans went loco over the driver big time. Beer and Cigarettes were the main sponsors so was it the chevy with the marlboro on it or the ford with budweiser on it? T H E N some one started making the dang cars to start fit these templates and so the cookee cutter cars were born. So whats left to say hooray over , the driver. Now we got cusins and brothers and for a while we had father and son teams blossoming out .

Now to your quest are you for rowdy kyle? or happy kevin? or maybe smoke or how about cusin carl ---dont forget kurt in his dodge---there are all 4 makes and five intigating drivers,----well they will try what it takes to get to the front --just like the old days.

so are the loyal to the driver?==the car?== the sponsor? == or the team?== souvenir sales say yes to all the above. there are photos of all four hanging up or in magazines or in store fronts or just about everywhere you can think, so bumpertag there is my version to your answer. Am I close???

And do you remember how we used to needle each other by saying:

Fix Or Repair Daily

Fred Outruns Richard Daily

Found On the Racetrack Dead ???

HeartBeat of America

i'm not sure if the sport has changed as much as i have not changed.i am becoming a grummp ole man not much of anything pleases me now.the world has forced me to learn computers,type,use a atm,drive cars that are made of plastic but it will not force me to watch todays nascar. i have became somewhat a rebel against it all.i bought a 68 ford to drive everyday.it gave me back the feeling of a real car.i also have a tundra that makes me feel like im of the couch.

i dont pull for no make of car now,i think they all suck.living in the 60s and 70s is were ill stay its safer and i dont have to be politally correct or even spell corrrecty.ill keep the old nascar in my head to play over when i miss it and take my naps on sunday.if want a race to watch ill pull up Billy Scotts pictures and see a real race.as i push the add reply button on my computer.

Good post Max. I wish I could be more like you in some views, but not watching NASCAR or pulling for a Chevy isn't one of them. To me NASCAR IS Ford Vs Chevy Vs Dodge and that other make that runs on rice alcohol. If I lose sight of that, then racing will not appeal to me nearly as much and I my also lose all desire to watch. I'm holding on to brand loyalty and rivalrys. I may pull secretly for a driver in a different make, but I stand up and cheer when the Chevys are out front.

It has changed BT but as I brought out after taking my grandsons to the 600 this year, the new fans are passionate but not about the same things we were. I was a Mopar man. It was late November, 1968, when Richard announced he was going to Ford for 1969. I HATED Fords. I rarely use the word "hate" but I HATED Fords. I sent him a letter telling him what a trader I thought he was. Never heard back on that one. In 1969, whenever I saw him, I snubbed him, but in a playful way. Then, at the Columbia Speedway race in 1969, August, there was an event on I-26 and I-20 AFTER the race which is a story from which Legends arise and I have plenty of witnesses to that. After the October race in Charlotte, he and I were walking through the garage together when he said he had a surprise coming for me. We all know it was back to Plymouth for 1970. Fans today pull for the drivers, for the most part, and the passion is there. Guess it really doesn't matter as long as there is a passion for something. The brand loyalty isn't there anymore with most fans although I shop Lowes instead of Home Depot because I thing JoLo is disgusting. There was a time I could name the sponsor of every car in the field and actually did that once for a survey at Daytona when a lady came around the infield asking for that information. My passion for racing is still in my heart, no doubt, but my passion for present day NASCAR, not so much.

Tim

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